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Lcm diploma by thesis writing

Lcm diploma by thesis writing these thesis diplomas


sheilakimberley 01 Dec 2015

I am exploring possibilities for us to do LCM Diploma by Thesis as private candidates from home, meaning we have need for some guidance. My son is capable of producing the work once he knows where he is headed, he has recently passed LRSM voice performance,Dip cello at the end of last year, and just sat Trinity LMus TCL (Theory).

Please can anyone offer some guidance on where to start and what is expected?

allegretto 01 Dec 2015

I looked into these a couple of years ago and found the chief examiner really helpful (and prompt) with advice and guidance – definitely worth emailing him with any queries. I think you need to have the topic approved (or at least they strongly advise you do) before you start. They seem quite open to a range of interests/ subject areas, so it’s useful to have an idea of something you really want to investigate to start with.

They’re looking for something of the level of a University essay, from second-year undergraduate at ALCM up to Masters level for FLCM, with the same expected structure (although exactly what form that takes would depend on the topic), academic conventions/ writing style, proper referencing etc. I thought the expected word counts seemed pretty high for the levels, but if you’ve got a topic you’re really interested in it gives you quite a lot of scope to get into it in depth.

I didn’t do it in the end as I ended up doing a Masters. still crosses my mind to revisit it for a specific project, but it feels like quite a lot of money to essentially have an essay marked and get some more letters after my name.

Have you and your son considered Open University courses for the academic side of things? Not sure exactly what they’re doing music-wise these days.

Lcm diploma by thesis writing SDod 01 Jan 2016

Seer_Green 02 Dec 2015

Agree with everything allegretto says. I also investigated these some years back – the Chief Examiner was indeed, very helpful.

I’d say that something like this is going to pretty much self-study. I don’t think you’d really find a teacher to help as the project will essentially be his own research – there might be people prepared to advise on the topic choice, research methods etc.

Even at ALCM level, he would need to be pretty confident in writing academic essays – research, methodology, referencing etc.

SDod 01 Jan 2016

Bit late on this thread, but I agree with allegretto and Seer_Green, the Chief Examiner is indeed very helpful and you should definitely get the topic approved prior to entering.

The word limits are a little high, in my opinion, but you do not need to necessarily meet the word limit, it is an upper limit after all. I would say that the standards are very much in line with university guidelines. Aside from in-depth research the theses really need to have a decent structure, coherent academic English and very thorough referencing. As Seer_Green says these diplomas are essentially the definition of self-study. Although you may get some helpful advice once the pen has hit the paper, it’s very difficult for a teacher to do much (we can point out some of the obvious things, of course, but anything more might amount to it not counting as the candidate’s own work).

As for topics, these can range from very musicological through music education to more psycho-sociological.

Lcm diploma by thesis writing Careful unpicking of LCM syllabus

The scope is very wide. Within this though it is probably essential (as with all dissertations and theses), to narrow the scope down to a specific (achievable) project.

I did the FLCM a few years ago.

Open University courses are probably very good, but they discontinued the Dip Mus sadly so the only pure music course they offer is the MA in Music.

sheilakimberley 11 Jan 2016

We do still have the Thesis in mind, but want to fill some gaps in his education, particularly History of Music and Harmony/Counterpoint, just trying to find a course or lessons to do this by distance or maybe a day a week at college/uni.

He has just passed this December Trinity LMus theory, yay! and wants to sit LRSM Cello performance in the summer to add to his LRSM voice performance.

He isn’t well enough to tackle a full time uni course and quite honestly we can’t justify the costs and student loans side of things, so far we have managed to fund his studies.

Any suggestions much appreciated.

SDod 12 Jan 2016

Not sure where you are based. An Open University module might do the trick, but not a cheap option by any means (these days). I know that in London there are some courses that might be relevant (e.g. at Morley College or City Lit, for example). I think many unis, and possibly conservatoires, might admit you as an ‘Associate Student’ just to study one or a handful of modules. So that could also potentially be an option.

Seer_Green 14 Jan 2016

I wonder if you’ve considered the music degree/modules offered by the Open College of the Arts (OCA)? These are very high quality courses and would include composition options too. Well worth a look.

sheilakimberley 14 Jan 2016

I’ve checked out Open Uni, but the actual content is difficult to dig out. He has some modules in French, German and Latin, but to be honest he didn’t particularly enjoy their courses, although he was quite young at the time. They are indeed pricey these days which is also off putting.

We are based in Worcs and travel is a bit of a drag especially if combined with study, but will check out those London colleges anyway.

I have come across the Open College of Arts, but it looks like it is mostly Composition modules, we really want to focus on Music History and also Harmony/counterpoint, which he really enjoys studying. Will have another look, might be worth seeing what we can do.

Will also see if we can get Associate Student status at a uni nearby. plenty of homework for me then!

SDod 16 Jan 2016

Good luck with the search and keep us posted – I’d certainly be interested in hearing if some other options materialise

sheilakimberley 01 Feb 2016

Well, so far no good, I have written to our nearest uni offering Music as an academic subject but they have failed to reply, twice to two different people. We have a copy of the prospectus but to be honest it’s more like a sales brochure than a guide to topics studied or offered. I even wrote about possible Associate Student options with no reply.

Open College do mention Music History but again no mention in any detail of counterpoint or harmony, if at all. I have also written to them detailing our position but again no reply.

Call us cynical but these days it does seem to be all about marketing of undergraduate courses for those £9,000 fees, and not much else especially if there is little financial gain for them. We are so aware of the shift in direction that the funding changes has caused, making it so competitive.

I’ve even written to the contend.ox.uk site to see if they have any suggestions.

This is terrible for a young chap to be unable to continue musical studies of an academic nature, we are managing instrument studies just about. I shall have to get my spade out and dig a bit deeper, not to mention the wooden spoon.

SDod 02 Feb 2016

Sorry to hear your bad luck at the moment sheilakimberley. It’s a difficult one.

Perhaps they will get back to you, are you contacting administrators or academics? I have to say the quality of university administration is generally poor (and challenging, from having been on the other side). However Associate Students are usually attractive as it’s extra money for relatively little effort, they don’t have to do all the associated admin and checking for a full programme enrolment. I think universities are generally over-stretched.

I must challenge your other point though. There is little to no difference for universities from the fee increase – universities are not largely benefitting, there are not huge increases in number of staff, nor their salaries. Most people (academics, administrators) are finding it a very challenging time in higher education. Things have changed hugely, mostly because students are now seen as consumers, and higher education as a product. This means that yes, there is increased competition and a lot of effort is spent on marketing etc. But it also means that there is generally little respect for academics and a lot of students are expecting very unreasonable levels of ‘service’, to the point that some essentially think they are paying £9000 a year to get a first class degree handed to them (!)

I try to remain optimistic about the future of education, but we are not in a good place at this moment. I’m fairly sure the Open University course includes a fair deal of harmony and counterpoint (several people on this forum have taken the OU courses over the years, so will be better placed to advise) – but I agree, the information they give is a little vague.

Perhaps the way forward (at least in the meantime) is for your son to do as much independent reading and research as possible and find some areas that he is very interested in? Of course this could be guided at various points using free resources such as this forum, or with a private teacher.

This would be a good step towards an LCM diploma by thesis, and the more analytical side would prepare him for the FMusTCL. To put things in perspective, though, you could step back a bit and say, hey, getting an LMusTCL does show final-year degree level standards of accomplishment in music theory/history, so that is something to celebrate! I would also hasten to add that even at universities and conservatoires, there are a lot of options and you may even find a first-class graduate in music who has avoided (evaded?) the music theory/harmony/history side at this deeper level.

I would also say that perhaps he could look at the AMusLCM/LMusLCM or ALCM/LLCM composition diplomas, as the former provide a more compositional slant on music theory and analysis, in my view, and the latter would be useful if he enjoys composing.

sheilakimberley 04 Feb 2016

The only Open Uni modules are the two that comprise the Masters degree, definitely nothing at undergraduate level. Going by their transfer of credit system it looks like he only has credit for year 1 and 2 of their 3 year course which seems a bit steep.

For example, the 180 QCF Level 6 (degree level) points for an LRSM or LMusTCL are only worth 65 credits at Level 2 of an Open Uni degree, seems a bit stiff to me.

Adding up everything he has musically and also from language study with OU he has 160 Level1 and 160 Level 2 potentially.

He aspires to do composition and writing eventually but we have dug deep and discovered that Trinity and LCM are looking for ‘innovative/experimental composition, my son is a classical/film/’nice’ composer. I have spoken with Trinity to clarify this and one example of what they look for is playing a violin with the bow downside up. Careful unpicking of LCM syllabus also suggests experimental is much the thing. this is a huge shame as he did their grade 8 happily.

I have now written to our nearest Conservatoire to see if we can pursue a course by distance and then go in for the exam. I might also try the university again, someone must be able to help us.

That leaves Thesis, something we have in mind once he has settled on a topic. I think he could do the Licentiate in Thesis having gained the Trinity Theory LMus, something I will ask about before we start.

jpiano 04 Feb 2016

The Open Uni do a 60 credit course at undergraduate level 2, Inside Music (A224) which covers theory, musical analysis and some composition- my husband took it, it was very similar to the content of my B Mus degree I did as a youngster. The composition was certainly not avant garde in any way- he had to set music to words and wrtie a piano part and he ended up with a rather nice tonal piece with a few mildly jazzy harmonies. Assessment is via a project-there’s no exam.

There is also a 60 credit undergraduate level 3 course, Central Questions in the Study of Music (A342) which covers the history side- it does have a written exam at the end of it which may put some people off.

Maizie 05 Feb 2016

Note that the way the OU pages are set up now, everything is geared towards an entire degree, and while details are pretty obvious for the first year, they don’t give you a lot of a look at the second and third level modules in a lot of detail.

However, it is entirely possible to take OU modules individually, i.e. without having to do an entire degree.

To see the module descriptions for the not-level-one courses, probably the easiest route is to google ‘open university a224’ or whatever the course code is (of course, finding out the code is the tricky part, if you don’t know the course exists!!)

sheilakimberley 14 Feb 2016

Thanks for those course codes, there is no way of unpicking anything beyond the first level modules, so this is great.

jonathanquinn 08 Feb 2012

I’;m not in a position to begin work for an LCM diploma by thesis at the moment as I am just finishing a PhD, but it’;s something I’;ve been wanting to do for a while. I started out wanting to be a professional musician but gave up because I wasn’;t very good at the practical side and not much better at the rest (got a B in A-level music). This is why the thesis diplomas appealed to me: I have good qualifications in philosophy, theology, and ancient and modern history, so a thesis on a philosophical, theological, or historical aspect of music would suit me. Three questions:

First, I have gathered that LCM diplomas enjoy less prestige than ABRSM and TCL. However, I know from the world of universities that there are those who will tell you that Oxford and Cambridge are the only universities in the UK worthy of the name, so I wonder whether the same applies to music examination bodies (my first degree was from Oxford, so I have no axe to grind here, apart from still reeling from the observations of one extremely distinguished Oxford don to the effect that my postgraduate qualifications from the University of London were of sub-undergraduate standard). I would say that ABRSM, TCL, and LCM would be the bodies I would look at: I know there are others, but I don’;t believe they have met the same accreditation standards.

Secondly, how likely is it that I could go straight into FLCM. I know that exemption from ALCM and LLCM is possible, and given that I have a BA and two MAs, and I am about to finish a PhD, I wonder whether they would consider that I was capable of going straight into FLCM, which is, after all, only set at master’;s standard.

Thirdly, how unmusical a thesis would they accept? I am very knowledgeable about music in a rather general way, but could never get my head around the intricacies of harmony and counterpoint and all the other things that proper musicologists can do. My proposed subject would be something, as I say, in the area of philosophical, theological, or historical approaches to music, conceptually, or to a particular musical subject.

jonathanquinn 08 Feb 2012

PS: I note that the FMusTCL thesis is only 12,000 words, whereas FLCM is recommended to be 25,000-30,000, which seems to me a large disparity for qualifications supposedly of equivalent standard. The FLCM would therefore seem like more of a challenge to work towards.

mel2 09 Feb 2012

I hadn’;t heard of diplomas by thesis, but having googled it, see that it is indeed an option.

If you have the time, the funds and the inclination for this then I’;m sure you realise the best thing to do is to contact the various boards and put your proposal to them and see if they bite.

Nobody else has responded (so far) so it must be an unusual option; however most people posting on this forum appear to work towards Performance/Recital or teaching diplomas.

Would you still be interested if you had to do A and/or L level before doing the F?

jonathanquinn 09 Feb 2012

If you have the time, the funds and the inclination for this then I’;m sure you realise the best thing to do is to contact the various boards and put your proposal to them and see if they bite.

Would you still be interested if you had to do A and/or L level before doing the F?

Thanks very much.

Yes, I am sure that contacting the board is the best thing, but at this very early stage, when I am not really in a position to get down to work on it properly, I don’;t want to muddy the waters by contacting a chief examiner with an enquiry that is still very unformed: better to take an informal sounding on a forum like this so that I have a better idea what to say to the official people.

The problems with doing the A and L before the F would be (a) more money to spend on examinations, whereas I would rather just fork out the once for the FLCM exam rather than have to pay for the lower levels first, (b) it would mean finding three separate research projects, as I understand it the ALCM is roughly second-year undergraduate standard, the LLCM roughly undergraduate dissertation standard, the FLCM roughly master’;s standard, so given that I have a BA and two MAs already, nearly a PhD finished, have given umpteen papers at universities up and down the country, and have taught up to final year BA level then to start again at the level a 19/20-year-old could manage would seem a bit pointless. I apologise if that sounds a bit arrogant, but I know where my strengths lie.

mrbouffant 09 Feb 2012

If I had a PhD, I’;m not sure I would bother with a ’;lowly’; FLCM. What is your motivation?

Neumer 09 Feb 2012

I’;d email the chief examiner Philip Aldred ( Philip.Aldred@uwl.ac.uk ). I got a pretty speedy reply from him regarding something similiar, and can confirm that you can indeed enter directly at LLCM and FLCM levels with certain qualifications.

Nothing wrong with the standard of the thesis exams incidentally, they are challenging, and relatively cost effective.

Alicia Ocean 10 Feb 2012

The syllabus currently displayed on the LCM website says it’;s for 2006-11. You might want to check it’;s still valid. I was looking at this late last year and the imminent expiry date put me off as I though it better to wait and see what the 2012 syllabus offers – but it’;s still the old document that’;s displayed there.

jonathanquinn 24 Apr 2012

Hello again, all. Thanks again for replies last time. I was in touch with the chief examiner and he was helpful. Apparently I cannot go in straight for FLCM as I have no higher education level music qualification. Not what I was hoping for, but I suppose it might be interesting to have a stab at two different dissertations.

Just a question to follow up: the chief examiner emphasised that I must understand that the dissertation must be on a musical topic. I am wondering whether anybody has any guesses as to what he had in mind (he did not seem to wish to enter into a protracted debate on the subject). From the tone of the message (notwithstanding that it was prompt, helpful, and polite — just in case he happens to read this forum!) I wondered whether he thought that I was proposing to submit a dissertation on horticulture or biochemistry. The main topic that I have in mind is an exploration of the question whether different art forms can be called higher and lower and whether music in particular can be called the highest. I would also be curious to see whether one could make a particular case for one composer being, according to some objective criteria, the highest expression of music. I would mean to approach this from a philosophical perspective, not a purely qualitative comparison based on personal experience. I am also interested in the question of whether religious belief affects aesthetic positions on different art forms and on music in particular (to spin off the famous saying about the head of the Madonna and the head of cabbage, does a religious believer hold that a bad hymn is worth more than a good symphony?). Would these seem to the man on the Clapham omnibus to be musical subjects?

miffy 24 Apr 2012

What are these thesis diplomas? Do you have a link to them?

Alicia Ocean 24 Apr 2012

The main topic that I have in mind is an exploration of the question whether different art forms can be called higher and lower and whether music in particular can be called the highest. I would also be curious to see whether one could make a particular case for one composer being, according to some objective criteria, the highest expression of music. I would mean to approach this from a philosophical perspective, not a purely qualitative comparison based on personal experience. I am also interested in the question of whether religious belief affects aesthetic positions on different art forms and on music in particular (to spin off the famous saying about the head of the Madonna and the head of cabbage, does a religious believer hold that a bad hymn is worth more than a good symphony?). Would these seem to the man on the Clapham omnibus to be musical subjects?

Wouldn’;t it be safer to just do a biography?

What are these thesis diplomas? Do you have a link to them?


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